Dr Linda Darling-Hammond, looking at 30 years of studies from the University of Chicago concludes in her new book The Flat World and Education, that three factors determin the quality of teachers.

1) Level of the teachers education
2) Certification
3) Experience

Dr Darling-Hammond is the acknowledged expert without peer in the USA in teacher education and teacher preparation.

Well it seems that this meta-analysis is at odds with the dear Darling.  Hanushek is no slouch at Stanford either.

Atlantic is right wing. Just proving an ideological not educational point. We can ask the parents, do you want more educated teachers or less educated teachers? I think we all know the answer.

We can also ask the parents:  do you want accountability to ensure that the teachers in the classroom are doing a diligent job, or no?
I think we all know what the universal answer to the above would be as well.

The federations survey both their members and the general public 3-4 times per year through Vector Polling. Guess what? The overwhelming majority of the parents are very satisfied.

There is a small band of malcontents, perhaps you know some of them. OISE also surveys on this as does the government and the parties.

People who feel like you Bev, are actually a very small minority. Did you ever wonder why you are being ignored? Believe me, if you constituted a significant voting block the politicians would be beating a path to your door. Queen’s Park is afraid of the opinions of Annie Kidder and no other parent in Ontario.

Tim Hudak will never agree with your opinions of class size reductions, cut backs, ECE etc in public because he knows it would be the kiss of death. Watch him start back peddling on phonics now that he has the leadership.

You know very well that parents were vertually offered much stronger Parent’s Councils and said they didn’t want it.

Quote-Dr.Reid Lyon,former chief of the NICHD Research Project answering the question ‘How do children learn to read,spell and write ?‘with a half of a billion dollars worth of reading research working to synthesize reading research not advertise ONE VIEW-consolidating the research over 25 years-
“If I could I would blow up all the teacher training institutions”.
Not very political but an admission that the link between developing effective teachers and children`s effective learning are directly linked.

I hope Mr.Hudak sticks with his plan although we need to talk about phonics-they need to be taught but the research on phonemic awareness as a precursor and ‘how to teach with sounds” as a methodology needs to be expanded on dramatically.Teachers desperately need training.
Doug,start sticking up for the kids,not the union.

Actually, a lot the parents I know are unhappy with education their children get.
That’s why they take time to teach them at home and to send them to Kumon or Sylvain or tutors so that they learn what the school should have been teaching.

Since the “overwhelming majority of the parents are very satisfied” with the school system, why not give the “small minority” back at least a part of the money they pay in taxes for the school system so that they can try and find for their children the education they feel is appropriate for their children?

It would only be fair.

Not an overwhelming majority satisfaction-
Employers who know me ask-why can`t people spell any more-they ask at University-what is happening out there-
Accountants ask-what is going on-we can`t hire people to write the reports that accompany the financials any more..those in business 30 years see a huge deterioration..
My hairdresser says-they send me people who can`t read-how can we give them an internship at our salon if we can`t trust them to read a formula or directions-
You are obviously sold on your perspective but it is not the view out there-employers and Universities are frustrated-
One vocational school principal said-how can I make plumbers and painters when they can`t read…
Don`t think you are right about your majority take…

Doug - you really must be called out on the labeling of explanations as either right or left wing.

I know that trick. It’s used often to discredit and even halt discussion. You must be very insecure in your stance because you keep throwing it out there for no particular reason that I see other than to irritate the folks here.

You’re not as quick to throw around those jabs on the other blogs you’re showing up on these days, why is that?

“Queen’s Park is afraid of the opinions of Annie Kidder and no other parent in Ontario.“

Don’t make me laugh Doug.

Yes, Queen’s Park is so afraid of Kidder that rumour has it that Wynne was marched out of education largely because of how close she was to Kidder and co. Perhaps it was a little too close that Dalton’s backbench grew to resent that Wynne was following People for Education’s agenda?

Your history of what parents were offered re: school councils(use the proper term please) are as skewered as the rest of your offerings Doug.  Parents were never offered anything more than the regulations dictated. Some councils, thanks to the “advisory” word amened OUT of the regulations on purpose managed to get lots of added responsibility and profile in their community.
None as obvious as the role councils play in accommodation reviews today.

People for Education came out against school councils but quickly realized that with a little help from their “friends” they could have free access to school boards, their mailing/courier systems and I have even heard that Kidder and co. had fans inside of the Ministry who directed parents to them rather to the OPC.

I have even heard a rumour that when organizations or other parent groups tried to apply for outreach grants for specific projects that they’d have a better chance of being accepted if they would partner with Kidder’s group.

All that changed for People for Education when, with help they recognized that school councils, those unsuspecting parents could be used to their advantage.

So Bev, pay no attention to what Doug spins on Kidder’s behalf.

Guaranteed that People for Education will see fewer of my taxdollars from now on. That they’ve rec’d your taxdollars should concern all parents.

I agree with Chuck-
People for Education-Annie Kidder is a PR firm for Queen`s Park-that is my personal view of their work also-they should change their name…

Frankly Charles, the voucher, merit pay, phonics, charters, direction is right wing in fact it is far to the right. The only hearing it gets in Ontario is within the PC party. The other 2 won’t touch them. The poor old Tories get saddled with public funding for private or faith schools as a policy which is a mill stone around their necks by the right wing lobby.

I’m sure you hear from the people who are not satisfied with the system but it is a big province and Jo-Anne you for one must know that anedotal evidence is not taken seriously. The types of basic level programs you are talking about are not designed for plumbers or carpenters, they are higher up the education ladder. Those programs are designed for semi-skilled and unskilled labour.

Parents were offered much more powerful councils and told Queen’s Park they were not interested.

Annir Kidder you might notice, has been giving Queen’s Park a lot of flack about the ELP which she feels does not go nearly far enough.

There is something that needs to be cleared up from “Europe”. People to not “get their tax money back for education” If it was ‘your tax money’ that educated ‘your kids’ then we would not tax childless people or people who’s kids have graduated. We all pay for public schools because they benefit all of us. I would love my Afganistan war taxes back since I don’t support the war effort but that is not how it works. If you buy your own books you do not get your library taxes back. If you hire your own security you do not get your police taxes back. If you want a private school for your child knock yourself out but don’t expect public support for it.

BTW I just love saying Annie Kidder once in a while around here because it is like poking the bears with a sick. Wow, what a reaction!!!!

Not an unusual reaction at all. Parents should know the truth and the history.

Here or anywhere else Doug, I do believe I just read the archives over at Crux of the Matter where this was raised too.

You’re not fooling anyone here.

Oh, and by the way, a little birdy happend to see Annie at the EQAO office when the organization was honouring Bette Stevenson. Would that be the same Kidder from People for Education who supports the union line about nixing the EQAO? Inquiring minds want to know.

Again, Annie’s often said she represents no parents, only herself as a matter of fact unlike most parents who have children in the public system Annie selected only the best schools for her kids….because she can. Too bad for everyone else I guess.

A reminder Doug that you don’t speak for parents either.

People for Eds. ELP will end up on the more money schtick….always does.

If none of what’s being discussed here poses a threat to the public system, what do you fight it? To me it’s a dead give-away that you’re distracting these people from what more and more people learn every day.

Annie Kidder started out as a supporter of testing but on her blog, has recently been seriously questioning it since it is clear, she says that it narrows the curriculum and that jurisdictions like Finland at the top of the pack do almost none.

Annie Kidder lived in the Palmerston school district and her kids went to Palmerston school. There are “higher scoring” schools around but Palmerston is a good school. Toronto has had for many many years, an open boundary policy for schools. I voted to maintain it at one time. Public schools are public schools.

If pressure makes the ELP cost more by adding more services that just makes it a better program.

Honouring Dr B.S. would be hard for me after I helped organize major demonstrations against her dur to her attempts to wreck education during her tenure.

She may claim to represent very few parents but the conferences P4E organizes dwarf anything organized by the right wing community. All I have really in common with her is an understanding that the worst possible thing for education in Ontario is a PC election victory.

Chuck,

Did you mean “why do I fight it?“ Your wording was a little awkward.

I fight reactionary education ideas everywhere I find them. I fight with my newsletter

http://www.thelittleeducationreport.com

and I fight for what I believe in any forum I can find. I also work hard for some Liberals and some NDPers in order to prevent another Tory education disaster from coming to Ontario.

You should catch my latest article on the Decline and Fall of Washington DC education chancellor Michelle Rhee, another teacher basher down the drain but not before she did a lot of damage to DC schools.

“..and I fight for what I believe in any forum I can find.“

Is it too hard a concept for you to understand that the folks here also are fighting hard for what they believe in?

You don’t hold a premium on that. I little respect and less political grinding would go a long way don’t you think?

Oh, and by the way, Annie’s kids also went to Ursula Franklin Academy and Rosedale Heights(don’t you remember that?) She’s even said as much. If you’re going to drop information at least drop all of it.

Annie’s a parent much like the rest of us and the end of the day she has no power continuing to do what she does best…whatever that is.

Parents who support choice believe more in themselves and what they have to offer their kids beyond what the public system offers, but within the public system too.

I think you’re here picking up ideas. Admit it.

What do you mean “I little respect” did you mean to say A little respect Chuck?

I taught at Rosedale Heights for 10 years, and have lots of comrades who taught at Ursula Franklin. Nothing very special about them compared to many many other schools in Toronto.

I happen to support choice as well, totally within the public school system. Always have.

Picking up ideas. LOL. Check my site and count the ideas you think came from here.

Chuck you are making me feel like you don’t like my comments here. Isn’t this a forum for all points of view? Is there a litmus test?

Not at all Doug. What I don’t appreciate, and are your politically charged remarks that you seem to like to drop in a very disrespectful way. The evidence is in your posts here.

You seem to be of the mind that conservative views don’t include improving the public education system or that we wouldn’t choose a public school for our kids despite being pro-choice in and outside of the public school system.

Rosedale and Ursula Franklin are as close as the TDSB got to private schools within that board. They don’t accept all students, require pre-requisites and portfolios, and in Franklin’s case interviews with student and parents before acceptance. Both are those “have” schools Kidder likes to trot out when she warns against a two tiered system. Guess as long as you can choose that top tier it’s ok though.

I still think your mining for something. Then again you could just really be after the excellent discussion here that peaks your interest. Great.

They are not private schools. They are packed full. Rosedale does not have auditions or per-reqisites. Rosedale accepted all studentd for many years. The building cannot accomodate all students now. The teachers gave up their staffroom for a classroom, there are classes on the stage. I told them many times, the market signals are there to open a second campus in the empty space in the east end but they have not listened as yet.

Please don’t put words in my mouth Doug.
Didn’t say they were private schools.

Rosedale Heights and Ursula Franklin “are as close as as the TDSB got to private schools within that board”... your words Chuck but if you want to backtrack or reiterate now be my guest.

Did you just intend to leave an elitist smear but leave yourself a figleaf to cover your argument? I understand.

actually Doug, those are exactly the words from a parent who sent children to those two schools while on a tour several years ago. Who were we to argue?

You understand nothing that poses a threat to the folks here whatsoever.

One person’s interrpretation Chuck. They are public schools. There are no auditions at RHSA. They are no different than the public schools in the leafy toney upper class neighbourhoods. Check the clients at Lawrence Park, Forest Hill, NTC, etc. They outscore private schools. In fact Paul Greyson at York U found that when you hold SES constant, public schools outscore private schools.